Football, Finance, and Future Goals: An Interview with Ashley Jones Lee

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Commentator

1138 to go. Second quarter shotgun formation. Now, Berlin,

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Ashley Jones Lee

there was a hit that Stanford Samuels is one of our D-backs laid on Roscoe Parish

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Commentator

Roscoe Parish wide on the right here is the snap.

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Ashley Jones Lee

But it was one of those hits that still on highlight reels strong.

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Commentator

Quarter hit Incomplete pass Roscoe Parish is certain to.

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Ashley Jones Lee

And I saw it live. My name is Ashley Jones lead.

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Daniëlle Keeven

American football and finance might only go together in professional player contract negotiations but for Ashley Jones Lee there's a personal connection.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I was that kid that was in Ghana and Gold. I was raised on FSU football.

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Daniëlle Keeven

And it was while Florida State admits her love for football that Ashley nearly went down a surprising path.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I wanted to be a, you know, Jodie Foster in Silence of the Lambs. I wanted to profile celebrity killers.

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Daniëlle Keeven

But as you learn this episode, the underlying reason isn't that surprising for one who would become CFO.

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Ashley Jones Lee

And love the why behind things. I just want to know why people do these things.

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Daniëlle Keeven

While Ashley didn't have a career in forensics, she's currently helping figure out the why as CFO of Up Tempo.

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Ashley Jones Lee

Essentially, we allow companies to run their marketing departments like a business.

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Daniëlle Keeven

But even a CFO has support under Detective Hat. Every once in a while.

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Ashley Jones Lee

You have to know the details in order to know the big picture.

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Daniëlle Keeven

Join us in learning about the life of Ashley Jones Lee including the lows.

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Ashley Jones Lee

Really shocking to see how demeaning other individuals could be. I questioned, am I in the right line of work? And how's this this groundbreaking? Because this feels right that.

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Daniëlle Keeven

Make her an effective financial.

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Ashley Jones Lee

Leader. I like using the past to figure out the future.

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Daniëlle Keeven

My name is Danielle. Kevin. Let's uncover the hidden stories of finance professionals as they navigate money, investment and growth. Let's look into the person behind the CFO title. Let's go beyond the budget before we get into the episode. If you enjoy the show, please leave a five star review of the podcast wherever you listen. It helps out the whole panel studios team tremendously, and let's continue to uncover the hidden stories of CFOs.

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Daniëlle Keeven

Ashley's Rhodes began in Florida, and while there are some typical answers kids have when asked what they wanted to be when they grew up, Ashley decided to head in a different direction.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I was born and raised in Stuart, Florida. It is a small, beachy town on the east coast of Florida. I grew up without seasons, right? You're wearing a sweater right now. I didn't get to wear sweaters too often when I was little. It was hot or hotter were the seasons. So I think when when you're young, you kind of default to a few things.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I want to be a doctor. I want to be a lawyer. Because you think about kids. You think everything's altruistic, right? Oh, they just help people. And so I think I just kind of didn't know who I was at seven who does. Right. And I kind of fell into that. Okay. Well, everyone else is saying, doctor, so I'll just be different.

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Ashley Jones Lee

Say lawyer. Plus, I was really good at arguing, so that always helps. I just want to help people. I want to be a lawyer. And I kind of really didn't revisit that until when I was starting college and then I revisited it again in college. So, yeah, I really loved history. I liked learning about the why. I always like the why behind things.

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Ashley Jones Lee

Why did people do something, the mistakes they made and history tends to repeat itself with a little twist. And so it was always interesting to me seeing the pattern and the evolution of thinking, but how people kept tending to make gravitate toward the same mistakes just in different times and periods.

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Daniëlle Keeven

Ashley wanted to make some history of her own, which is part of the reason that she ended up at Florida State University. Listen to her next. Discuss one way her time with FSU is special and pay close attention to when she talks about the best football game she attended While there.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I was that kid that was in Ghana in gold cheering for Florida State. I was raised on FSU football. My dad is a huge football fan, Florida State football fan, and so I was raised on it. It's funny, when it came down to my college decision, my final two choices were Auburn or Florida State. I narrowed it down to two and my senior year Auburn went undefeated and FSU had five losses.

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Ashley Jones Lee

So that's karma. But no, it was great too, to realize that dream because I just always wanted to be there. And when I stepped on campus to do the tours, it just felt like home. Greg Jones was a business major. He was one of our running backs. He's a massive human. I would see him in the College of Business.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I think he was like a general business major. I was accounting and finance, so we didn't share classes. But there's a lot of these guys are so big in person, right? And you see them on TV or from the stands and they're all about the same sizes. So you're like, Oh, okay. But then when you see him up close, you're like, Oh my gosh, you are a specimen.

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Ashley Jones Lee

So yeah, it was actually FSU, Miami in 2004, I believe it was either 0405, it was Abdo and it was a torrential downpour. I got home and I felt like it was paint coming off my clothes, right? It was so rainy. We lost the game. But there was a hit that Stanford Samuels is one of our D-backs lead on Roscoe Parrish.

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Ashley Jones Lee

He ended up putting him in the ICU, I think. So it was a pretty brutal hit, but it was one of those hits that's still on highlight reels, and I saw it live and like you heard the crack and it was just one of those things. I was like, that hit made the loss worth it. I'm a defense girl.

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Ashley Jones Lee

So yeah, it was it was beautiful.

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Daniëlle Keeven

It wasn't all fun and football games at FSU, Ashley went in with an unexpected career direction. As you listen to the rest of the episode, make sure you remember what drives Ashley as she'll talk about next.

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Ashley Jones Lee

So when I started college, I wanted to be a, you know, Jodie Foster, Silence of the Lambs. I wanted to profile celebrity killers because, like I said, I love the why behind things. I just want to know why people do these things so I can help prevent it in the future. That was my path. And then I took an elective.

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Ashley Jones Lee

It was a police academy class. I was doing community college over the summer home. There was an elective and then it was like a death and dying class or something along those lines. And they had crime scene photos and one of the photos had a three year old in it. I had a half sister who was the same age at the time.

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Ashley Jones Lee

All I did was relate that to her and I was like, I'm pretty sure you can't differentiate what cases you'll take, right? You don't know what you're going to find. I was like, Yeah, I could not handle cases with children because my parents were in finance and I was like, Well, I guess I'll try the old family trade and see how it works out.

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Ashley Jones Lee

And here I.

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Daniëlle Keeven

Am. What her direction steering away from death and dying and towards finance. Ashley's career kicked off. Listen next to discuss whether she nailed her first interview with ConAgra and then how a mentor shaved her understanding of her finance team role.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I would say no. I don't think I really started nailing interviews until I had a little more experience under my belt, because I think when I was younger, it was, what do I think they want to hear? I think there was probably a disconnect at that point with I think this is what they want to hear. Is that how I feel?

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Ashley Jones Lee

No, but it's a place, a business. I can't be myself. I can't bring certain things into the business place. And so I feel like it was probably pretty stiff and rigid and all about numbers. I didn't have my Ashley flair at that point right. Because I also think just from an overall macro trend, authenticity in the workplace is something that probably wasn't as widespread back then.

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Ashley Jones Lee

Probably one of my first true mentors, it was actually not early in my career. Unfortunately, I learned this lesson a little bit later. Midway through my career. She told me that there's always a balance. There's always a way to say yes. It might not be the typical path. Finances job isn't to only say no, it's to be creative and figure out how to say yes.

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Ashley Jones Lee

And that always stuck with me because up until that point, right, I would hear as entry level and then working my way up, I would always hear, Oh, the CFO, it's everything will get blamed. Finance was the scapegoat on why we couldn't do something. I questioned, Am I in the right line of work? Because that's not me to just say no.

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Ashley Jones Lee

And then I learned that and I was like, Wow, this is this is groundbreaking because this feels right now that I have that tidbit of knowledge. And so, yeah, I would say that was probably the pivotal point where I realized you can be authentic, you can be yourself and you can partner with people and be agreeable while still being practical at the same time.

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Daniëlle Keeven

So some of the greatest lessons you'll learn as a leader happened through examples of what not to do. Listen next to how her own experience with leaders was pivotal to becoming a great one herself.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I will not mention names. They are not here to defend themselves. However, a couple examples immediately come to mind. I would say the first was making the assumption that when a woman has a baby, she's not going to come back to work and telling people that just automatically, assuming that if you're a woman, you have one priority. It's your career until you have kids and then that's it and your career's over.

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Ashley Jones Lee

So I would say that was a big eye opening. Oh, is this how it's going to be? When I was coming up, I was always one of the only women in my peer group. It was really shocking to see how demeaning other individuals could be. I wasn't asked for an opinion unless it was something that was admin related or visual or is that right?

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Ashley Jones Lee

It was like, Oh, well, the girls have the style, but just you stay over there, sit and look pretty and let the guys do the work. So I would say those two things were really like, Oh no, I never want to exclude someone. I never want to make certain assumptions based on how someone looks, how they dress. I want to make sure I get to know the person inside and foster their actual talent versus the surface level things.

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Daniëlle Keeven

Using the negative to inform the positive isn't the only inspiration Ashley calls upon. As you'll hear next to her familiar experience has completely changed her leadership style. And then as she talks about the idea of building your own seat at a table and her experience with Chief a membership network focus on connecting and supporting women executive leaders.

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Ashley Jones Lee

My kids, my oldest will be six in June. He actually completely changed my leadership style. Becoming a mother has made me so much more of an empathetic leader because I think what I want someone treating my kids this way, I try to think about that before I have. Whether it's giving critical feedback or having a tough conversation, how would I want my kids to receive this news?

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Ashley Jones Lee

Because that's that's a different level than how would you want to receive this news? Right. Of course, you know, as someone who's in I'm 40, right? That's a woman who's 40. I've built that thick skin. But kids haven't. I try to use a certain empathetic and compassionate quality when it comes to my leadership. But I think it also made me realize everyone's an individual, right?

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Ashley Jones Lee

You cannot have this cookie cutter style of leadership. You have to get to know your people. What motivates them, what gets them out of bed in the morning, What is their North star? Why are they here besides a paycheck? And then you have to tailor your approach to every individual. I think that's really how my leadership style has evolved, both from being a woman, were highly intuitive, and so that helps getting to know someone quickly.

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Ashley Jones Lee

Right? But also as a mom, it really helps refine my leadership craft. Coming up in my career, it was kind of you just do what you do, You put your head down and you wait for a seat to open up. And why? Why can't you just choose your make your own? Why do you have to wait for your turn?

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Ashley Jones Lee

I think that there's something so empowering about taking charge of your own journey and not just waiting for someone to tell you, Hey, you're up. No, I'll tell you when I'm ready. Tell you when I'm up. Right? And so there's just something that's so profound about that. And I love the mission about creating your own see, your own power, your own journey.

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Ashley Jones Lee

I really resonated with me so deeply and finding a group of women who all believe that there's enough room at the top for all of us. Because I can't tell you how many times I encountered coming up in my career cattiness between women and jealousy. And because where you're fighting for that one allocated seat that that's designated to to someone like, you know, there's enough room for success for all of us.

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Ashley Jones Lee

It's so much more wholesome and powerful to root for others. Right. Why wouldn't you cheer other people on? You would want people to do that for you. And so the whole premise of Chief just has completely resonated with me. I love it. I can't say enough positive about it.

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Daniëlle Keeven

Next, as she talks about the intersect between finance and technology as finance director at Conduit, then she gets into when she realized she wanted to be CFO.

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Ashley Jones Lee

So I was there through the adoption of 606. Right. The new revenue standard. So I would say just from a cleanliness person, you're right, it was really messy trying to implement 606 on this line of business. But the thing that I actually loved about it is, as I mentioned before, I really love change and our products were either you could have them just off the shelf or there were highly customizable versions.

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Ashley Jones Lee

And working with the tech team, that was my first real exposure on that intersect between finance and technology. So working with the tech team on those highly customizable cases was so enlightening. I loved it and I was a tell me more, tell me more, Show me how you're doing this, right as someone who loves learning. And so for me, it was more about the behind the scenes.

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Ashley Jones Lee

To me, finance is finance. There are always nuances, but when people are so buttoned up in an industry, it's like, Yeah, okay. But I mean, it's kind of the same where you go plus or minus a few regulations are rules. And so I really loved the work behind it and just the innovation that was possible behind SAS. When I was in college, I was, I did a dual degree accounting and finance.

00:14:14:19 - 00:14:36:17

Ashley Jones Lee

When I was in my accounting classes. The questions I would get, are you doing audit or tax? Either Why do I have to pick one of those? Right? And so I decided to go into just a corporate accounting role. I did it and I realized this is great learning experience, but I don't want to know that on the 15th day of the month, I'm going to be doing exactly X, Y, and Z.

00:14:36:17 - 00:14:53:11

Ashley Jones Lee

I need a little variety here. I started playing around with different, different roles, right? I went to a tax role was a contract role, but I went to a tax role. Then I went to corporate finance and I was like, I like this. I like forward looking. I like using the past. Similar to the history parallel, right? I like using the past to figure out the future.

00:14:53:11 - 00:15:12:15

Ashley Jones Lee

And for me, finance is just so much more strategic and forward looking. And so then I started looking up CFO job descriptions. What do I have to do to get there? And so that's kind of how I forged my path and made my career decisions from then on out was, will this help me in my ultimate goal if it will sign me up, if it won't, probably going to pass.

00:15:12:20 - 00:15:30:18

Ashley Jones Lee

And so that's how I ended up on my career path was I knew at a young part of my career that I wanted to go this route. I don't think I'll ever say I've made it. I am someone who believes there's no such thing as too much self-improvement. There's no such thing as making it, so to speak. I think you can always make something better.

00:15:30:18 - 00:15:47:12

Ashley Jones Lee

You can always be better. Yes. I loved checking that box off seven years I had a sketchbook because I obviously I had goals by a certain age. I want to do this. So I love checking that box off. But now I'm like, What's next? What else can I do to be better for myself as a person, for the world?

00:15:47:12 - 00:15:51:08

Ashley Jones Lee

And then what other companies can I go in and change for the better?

00:15:54:18 - 00:16:05:10

Daniëlle Keeven

Firmly Inertia for title Now at uptempo, Ashley next discusses a pivotal moment that informs her position to this day. Listen close to her experience. While at Xerox.

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Ashley Jones Lee

The first time I saw it was when I was at Xerox. It was the first time I had to make some tough decisions. I would say with regard to restructuring the business that I was over it again, it taught me how to weigh things in terms of this is what the business needs. So the obvious answer is to cut X, Y or Z.

00:16:31:02 - 00:16:56:13

Ashley Jones Lee

But now let me think about it from what the people need, what are the ramifications? And so that kind of put me into this hybrid approach of weaving between the details and the big picture and the current, you know, balancing the short term, current and long term needs. That's a really important part of being a CFO. I think a lot of people assume that we sit in our ivory towers and we just direct people and we just count money greedily with a safe behind us.

00:16:56:13 - 00:17:21:09

Ashley Jones Lee

Right. And like, that's not it. It's actually a very labor intensive job. I'm not talking manual labor. I'm talking. Right. You have to know the details in order to know the big picture. It's a craft, right? Being able to know both and being able to weave between both. And I would say that my time at Xerox, which then became kind of what really set me up for that, because that was the place where I learned, Hey, I need to do both in order to be really good at this.

00:17:25:06 - 00:17:37:07

Daniëlle Keeven

A key part of what makes Ashley effective at her role is her experience with a distributed team. Listen next. As she talks about the guiding principles that make a remote work culture thrive from a CFO perspective.

00:17:42:19 - 00:18:02:21

Ashley Jones Lee

You're asking some of an expert. I've been remote way before. It was cool. I've been for Mode since 2013, so a wave of work of it. So I'm kind of a veteran in this space. One thing I learned is if it's not a benefit for everyone, it's not a benefit getting rid of the Oh, well, the people at the office get this, but the people at home don't get that.

00:18:02:21 - 00:18:32:03

Ashley Jones Lee

Okay, well then you can't call it benefit because it's not for everyone. And so trying to get creative in how can we make everyone have the same experience. And so you mentioned the savings rate. And part of that is savings and turnover, because there we have we have all these great benefits for people tied to company locations. But what about people that aren't, hey, let's give them a wellness scholarship, let's allocate some money to them that we would have spent if they were sitting in our brick and mortar and let's let them make their own choose their own adventure.

00:18:32:03 - 00:18:46:02

Ashley Jones Lee

Right? For me, it's all about providing the same experience. One of the things I do with in my team building is I don't care if you're in an office, I don't want you sitting in a conference room. I want everyone individually on their own zoom. I want everyone to have the same experience. I don't want the side conversations, right?

00:18:46:02 - 00:19:05:10

Ashley Jones Lee

I want us all to feel the same. And I think that's really important. Just getting rid of that. US versus them, remote versus on ground, because that's a dividing factor and you can't have a cohesive culture if you have two very different groups of people and you're just trying to mold them together with different benefits, different standards, everything, right?

00:19:05:10 - 00:19:23:06

Ashley Jones Lee

You have to provide a seamless experience for everyone. It was all about the experience, right? The employee experience. A lot of times people, the first thing they cut when they need to is they cut investment into employees or they cut things for employees. And it's pretty shortsighted if you don't think about, well, what does that do to turnover?

00:19:23:06 - 00:19:32:16

Ashley Jones Lee

Turnover has a pretty hefty cost, right? What does that do to morale? People are not going to show up and give you their best if they're not feeling engaged and attached to the mission.

00:19:35:19 - 00:19:46:19

Daniëlle Keeven

On the flip side of remote work is the idea that you never leave work. Ashley next discusses some of the leading indicators that inform when it might be time to recalibrate the work life balance skill.

00:19:49:18 - 00:20:10:05

Ashley Jones Lee

Kids will tell you in their own way when they need more Mom Right? When my kids get really clingy or when there's no such thing as too much mom time, right? I realize, Hey, maybe I like to think I'm self-aware, but I'm not always self-aware when it comes to this. My kids will remind me. I think it's just noticing a shift in their behavior.

00:20:10:05 - 00:20:28:02

Ashley Jones Lee

They've probably been getting the short end of the stick lately, so I should probably shift things around a little bit more and give them some more. Mommy time. I remember when I first started working remote at a primarily on ground location and everyone just assumed, Oh, she works remote so she makes baby food all day or like just laundry.

00:20:28:02 - 00:20:42:15

Ashley Jones Lee

I don't think I would put my hours against your any day of the week. And I bet I work way more. Right. Because there's you don't leave work your home is your office. I hear my email go off at 9:00 and I'm like, Oh, well, before I go get ready for bed, I'd better go check that. And then I'm in there for an hour.

00:20:42:16 - 00:20:49:11

Ashley Jones Lee

You're right. It's you have to really work hard to try to differentiate between home and work. When you work at your home.

00:20:53:00 - 00:21:06:22

Daniëlle Keeven

As she reflects back on our CFO career. Ashley gives some parting wisdom. Pay close attention to the parallels she sees between initial interest in history, her fascination with engineered beauty and her current finance head role.

00:21:10:11 - 00:21:29:20

Ashley Jones Lee

Using what happened in the past to look forward. It's interesting now that you say that and I think about it's like what makes sense? Because science, like art and science is finance is both. Yeah. It's interesting now that you say that with the history, the parallels, right? I appreciate architecture, I appreciate landscape, I appreciate esthetics. He pleasing things.

00:21:29:21 - 00:21:49:12

Ashley Jones Lee

I find beauty in things that you would be blind not to find. And it's beautiful buildings. How do you not appreciate that? No, I think about that a lot. When I go somewhere, I'm like, I wonder back in like 1600 how they got that statue. They didn't have cranes. And so I think about that too, is like, how did they do that?

00:21:51:05 - 00:22:02:09

Ashley Jones Lee

Be true to yourself. Choose your own path. Don't get too worried about a path that someone else carves out for you. Don't be afraid to take chances and be creative in your career path.

00:22:05:07 - 00:22:28:14

Daniëlle Keeven

Special thanks to Ashley Jones Lee for being on the show. You can find her on LinkedIn if you'd like to thank her yourself. Know anyone who would be great for the show? Send an email to our senior show producer Ben Dot Hillman at padlocked com. Also, please leave a five star review if you enjoyed the podcast. We'll see you next time on Beyond the Budget, a podcast from Shadow Studios dedicated to helping you build better SAS.